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Borror0 needs your help[edit]

It seems this might require your access or skill level. --Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 02:41, January 17, 2017 (EST)

Looks like this could be solved (without direct access) by using UserMerge twice? --Cru121


Hey! Respectful disagreement re Emotes. Maybe just need their own subsection - see my thoughts here: Talk:Emote. No rush, hardly time-critical. :) C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 23:21, January 8, 2016 (EST)

Bump - Been a week, so I'll go ahead and just separate the 2 sub-groups on the existing Chat/Commands page in a couple days if you have no comment. All good, later, C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 15:22, January 15, 2016 (EST)
  • I've been stupid busy. What was this conversation about? ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 16:31, January 15, 2016 (EST)
    • NP, figured as much. In a nutshell, a week ago I had moved "emotes" to their own page, and you reverted, keeping them combined w/ /commands on the chat page. I understand WIKI "KISS" reasoning etc., but I feel they ~are~ markedly diff than in-game /commands. I think they should (at least) have their own separate subsection on same /chat command page. (full reasoning here: Talk:Emote). Unless you object, I'll do that w/ code that had been on separate page. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 18:27, January 15, 2016 (EST)
      • I thought I had said it's fine to put them in their own section on the page, but not to split it out into it's own page. Too many pages on the same topic makes it harder to search for topics. I may not of, my memory isn't what it used to be... ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 21:04, January 15, 2016 (EST)

Hireling pages[edit]

On another topic - the Table on this hirelings page was too messed up to read, and I didn't know how to fix it w/ Template:Hirelings_phantom. I copied the table code from the main List of Hirelings page, but that one doesn't use the Template. I ~did~ save all existing code as a comment below the (now legible) current table. You were the last to edit that page, so figured you'd know best how to proceed, if any correction needs to be made at all. (If you want to line me out, happy to do the work, just lemme know what/how, or where to read up on it.) Thx, C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 15:22, January 15, 2016 (EST)

  • You should never use T:Hirelings phantom. All of the hireling pages are likely borked right now as it will be a major project for me to go through and build all the new templates for all of them. Still on my list of things to do, but it is a fairly complicated template system (yes, system), so it'll be awhile before I can get around to it. You'd have to have lots of template/DPL experience to figure it out, so it's likely best left to someone with that level of knowledge (maybe Zav or ... not sure who else has that level of knowledge that is active). ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 16:31, January 15, 2016 (EST)
    • I found it there (but broken), that's the only reason I even asked. K, old-school hard-coded table works for now, and I (clearly) need the practice anyway. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 18:27, January 15, 2016 (EST)

29 Edits and NOT counting...[edit]

btw - When I first landed here a week ago, you had edited my User home page by removing full code to Edit Counter and replacing w/ a Template for same - cool in theory, but it seems to be "not" counting, stuck on "29 and counting" for well over +100 edits since. Best fix? Thoughts? C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 18:27, January 15, 2016 (EST)

  • Not automatic (yet). Manually update it once every tier or 300-500 edits... ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 21:07, January 15, 2016 (EST)

All Good[edit]

In order - Agreed, will do; (Resolved); & Roger that. Afaic this can all be wiped clean. Get some sleep, brother. o7 C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 01:42, January 16, 2016 (EST)

New account welcome[edit]

You asked me about a design for MW:Welcomecreation-msg. I like the way this looks and works. Obviously it has a completely different purpose. You could change the sort button into next and previous buttons or a submit button. You could have one question at a time or all of them on the screen at once. I figure the code for selecting categories from a list could be used to ask which servers the user plays on. Are the question responses going to be used to create a first talk page post or a blurb on the user page? If so, I would suggest not automatically saving but preloading it so the user has the option to edit it before saving. — Zav(T·C) 19:06, January 16, 2016 (EST)

  • Funny you mention it. lol I just created a TESTNEW account to see what creating an account currently does to get an idea for working on this project. I was thinking a simpler version of The Wikipedia Adventure customized for DDOwiki. ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 20:26, January 16, 2016 (EST)
    • That would work too. I've never run through TWA, but it would be useful to have a learning exercise for new editors. — Zav(T·C) 20:40, January 16, 2016 (EST)

Why keep page?[edit]

Why are we keeping this page Talk:Trade_between_charactors? It reads more like a forum post, there is no actual article behind the "talk", the Trade page covers it all plus more, and (almost) nothing links to it. If there is a reason, what's the rationale that I'm missing? (Also, a quick edit note as to ~why~ you are reverting will help me understand local Wiki policy better, thx!) C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 17:39, January 18, 2016 (EST)

  • Talk pages are not blanked or deleted. They keep record of discussions and are suppose to look like forum posts. They are for wiki discussion, not for visitor research. :) ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 17:54, January 18, 2016 (EST)
Sure, but they are supposed to discuss the article in question, not be created in and of themselves, right? That page was never "for Wiki discussion", the answer was never molded into any page (until Trade) - it was a player's personal question, pure and simple. Which is what the forums are for. Maybe move it to the Talk on that Trade page?C-Hound (ContribsMessage)

Regarding Template:Stat[edit]

No issue with you reverting my change, but then why is User:JJMC89 policing my edits for something he is either wrong about or that doesn't matter? See Item:Diamond of Spooky Wisdom +2 and Item:Diamond of Spooky Intelligence +2. I don't appreciate nitpicking on things that are irrelevant and I don't like being pulled between 2 admins who differ on what is correct or incorrect. Thanks. Susalona (ContribsMessage) 21:44, January 20, 2016 (EST)

  • The reason it is all caps in the example section of the template is to show that the template is coded cleverly enough to not care about what case is used with the template. That said, it's good practice to use the normal proper case on articles (knowing the template won't care if you accidentally type SPooky or sPooky instead of Spooky) for the sake of readability. Zav polices my edits sometimes too, it doesn't break anything and calms an apparent pet peeve of his, so I just let it be. ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 22:03, January 20, 2016 (EST)


Looking to update this but running into a couple issues and would like a couple pointers if possible.

  1. Old items (pre-U29) used Wizardry I to XI for 25 to 275 spellpoints. Newer items use integers, and those integers are exactly the spellpoints you get. The current template uses something that converts integers to roman numerals. I was wondering if a reverse tool existed (convert roman numeral to integer) and if we can then multiply this result by 25 prior to returning it, but I'm not sure where to even begin looking for this.
  2. In general, what style of coding does the Wiki use, and what's a good place to learn this code better?

Thanks in advance. Habreno (ContribsMessage) 17:39, February 2, 2016 (EST)

  • There is {{Roman2Dec}} (available from the "Template Functions" version of the edit tools below). You're also going to want to use {{Int}} to display numbers probably. As for style of coding, it's not really 'defined' since only like 3 people do it, but you can probably get the idea based on checking out existing templates. ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 18:19, February 2, 2016 (EST)
    • I have it completely done up in Python, and working relatively well. I just can't find some of the tools I need to get it done in wikicode. I've posted the Python version (including a romantodec conversion) in the discussion page User_Talk:Habreno/Wizardry for the proposed rewrite; if there's some source I'm missing please link it. Habreno (ContribsMessage) 17:29, February 15, 2016 (EST)
      • YAY! I think we have it! See User:Habreno/Wizardry. Still needs the Categorization, but that's not as difficult. Of importance: None of the old pages should have to be updated, unless they expressed the Wizardry in an integer format instead of a Roman Numeral format. Habreno (ContribsMessage) 00:57, February 29, 2016 (EST)
        • Updated with a second parameter (which defaults to Enhancement if unlisted, to keep compatibility with old templates). A lot of items will need updating to properly show (a lot of items used Ints instead of Roman Numerals...); I could go through them manually or perhaps there's a bot that'd be able to do it? Habreno (ContribsMessage) 16:21, February 29, 2016 (EST)

U29 Armors[edit]

I noticed that the armors availaible from Legendary Tempests Spine and Legendary Hox show PARRYING numbers in the tooltip (barter box) that differ from the current wiki pages. I cannot confirm which is correct as I don't own any of these armors. If someone can confirm I can amend the pages (or not) as neccessary. Eddivan (ContribsMessage) 17:37, May 24, 2016 (EDT)

  • Do you have a specific list of pages? I have some of the armors, and could probably get others pretty easy from guildies linking or whatnot. Thanks. ShoeMaker (ContribsMessage) 17:48, May 24, 2016 (EDT)

Monster Manual[edit]

I'd appreciate your input on what to do with Jeets Shimis. Under the "I Dream of Jeets section", he has a monster manual type of Halfling, with a comment stating "unkillable", but he's not in MM. It's not that he's missing from MM, because he doesn't get killed, and therefore should not appear in MM. What would you do with him? Give him a MM type of None?

Same deal with Rand. I suspect Super-Ego can't be killed either, and therefore also falls into this category. Eeepy (ContribsMessage) 18:16, July 2, 2016 (EDT)

  • He's not killable, and I wouldn't consider him a monster. I found another one like that and I changed it to use the NPC template instead. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 19:01, July 2, 2016 (EDT)


looking good. like the additions (new information). see your section on the very bottom? :P--Uurlock (ContribsMessage) 13:47, September 5, 2016 (EDT)

Single monster and list of monsters in one habitat[edit]

Hey there.

This finally looks good enough to ask for review. All of it is still unoptimized, kludgy-but-solid-enough and expected to change as necessary, but for the first time it does what I want it to do. I didn't even try automatic categorization, since I still have difficulties understanding the flow of some of that in {{Monster}} and elsewhere, so if this gets green-lighted, it will probably need your expertise. Moreover, it does away with the numbered habitatNN and hnoteNN: forgive me, but while trying to make this system work with them, I got blinded by the flash of genius of how to make it work without them. As I said, it's all expected to change as necessary.

Let me show you what I have now:

The first two links go to monster pages using an almost-standard {{Monster}} and a few other templates and phantom templates.

Magefire Cannon has its auxiliary templates inside its own parameter "habitat", unnumbered to get skipped by {{Monster}}, one row per aux template. Kobold Shaman has its aux templates outside of {{Monster}}, with some aux templates exploded for readability. They all work the same, as far as this system is concerned.

Both pages are full of overkill extraneous and/or unlikely and/or plain wrong data, in order to try functionality of the whole system. Both pages sport a dpl table that I believe should eventually be embedded in {{Monster}}, with all the due modifications. The dpl code in each page queries the very same page itself, pulls out data from {{Monster}} first; then, row by row, the queries override default data from {{Monster}} if there's a same-named parameter in the aux template corresponding to the habitat in question. This can (and most likely will) produce a table with mostly identical rows: I've left Kobold Shaman actual data almost intact in order to show just that. On the other hand there are examples of monsters with severely variable data from habitat to habitat.

The third link goes directly to a few examples of what in my mind should become the monsters section of {{Quest}}. It works similarly, but with no self-querying; row by row, dpl pulls out default monster data first, then a sub-query checks aux templates, and if the habitat is the right one, it overrides default monster data as necessary.

As you can see, the testbed quests don't even exist. I planned to use User:Aldyron/Sandbox/Missing in Action as a testbed for interaction with {{Quest}}, but I doubt it will be necessary.

Oh, while I was at it, I put in a new parameter called "group", that I intended to suggest for inclusion in {{Monster}}, useful for, say Devil Assault (quest) or The Storm Horns.

I'm at your disposal to discuss the whole thing, but not before tomorrow: right now I have 16:9, rectangular, pipe-shape-slotted eyes and I don't want to see any more dpl code for at least 24 hours! :-))

Aldyron (ContribsMessage) 16:35, October 11, 2016 (EDT)

  • I see what you've done and it looks like a lot of extra end user work (which the purpose of the changes is to reduce long term end user work). I'll have to look at it again and maybe play with it a little, but it looks over complicated at first glance. Maybe I can make it simpler. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 19:38, October 11, 2016 (EDT)
  • On that matter, I'd like to point out that numbering similar-named parameters, while useful for programming purposes, is also extra end-user work. I silently did the extra work until now, but since the topic came out... Case in point, Lesser Gray Ooze, freshly edited: I deleted two habitatNN lines, so after that I had to edit another 29 lines (i.e., the whole habitatNN/hnoteNN block) to correct the numbering. Just my opinion.
Aldyron (ContribsMessage) 19:47, October 12, 2016 (EDT)
  • It's not really extra work. Once they are all gone through and initially set to the current set of the game, it's just a matter of adding them as they appear in new quests. It's unlikely that once a monster is in a quest it will ever be removed. For that matter, the template should allow for a certain size gap in numbering to make it so renumbering manually is not needed (I can write a simple bot script for maint purposes but it won't affect the display any). The English Wikipedia allows for a gap of 5 numbers per set (so, 1, 2, 3, 8, 9, 12 is fine but 1, 2, 3, 24, 25, 30 is not). ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 20:20, October 12, 2016 (EDT)
    In fact, I just created T:Monster/sandbox to test the issue with gaps, they don't have to be renumbered at all. So, no additional work there. Smile ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 20:34, October 12, 2016 (EDT)

Broken template[edit]

It appears you made changes to Template:Enhancement table/item that broke it. Witness the formatting errors on nearly every row of Pale_Master_enhancements. Hoopy Froodle (ContribsMessage) 18:17, October 12, 2016 (EDT)

  • Thanks. I was aware of that. It's actually the usages of the template that are broken and the template that was fixed. The template used to have a hack job in it to accommodate cases where the link was manually set to ... or . We are no longer doing that horrible way of seeing what pages are missing and are instead just going with redlink page names. Every page that used to use that old style of formatting will need to be updated. It'll just be a matter of time and it should all be fixed, not something I can bot edit - needs to be done manually one at a time. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 18:25, October 12, 2016 (EDT)

SR Items[edit]

Hello. I can't find SR in "Items by effect group" and in "Items by effect". Please say, I didn't find them or they don't exist. UL (ContribsMessage) 15:16, October 16, 2016 (EDT)

Help! I broke a page ..[edit]

I was throwing some data from Korthos into the Small Brown Spider monster page. I do not know much about the coding on this wiki page, so I just cut and paste a few elements. I cut and paste the habitat1 line and renamed it, and added a cut and paste of the Xpcolors line. Now the page has some doubling issue, and it shows code instead of links.. ?? what did I do wrong..?? — previous unsignedIcon tooltip.pngPlease sign posts using ~~~~ comment by Graendahl ( c |d| r| b) at 16:10, December 18, 2016 (UTC)

  • Fixed ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 11:14, December 18, 2016 (EST)
    • Thank you, but what did I do worng? Besides "oops" forgetting to sign my post. Graendahl (ContribsMessage) 11:19, December 18, 2016 (EST)
      • See T:Monster#USAGE, in particular pay attention to the bottom of the Notes: section for usage of the |habitat#=, which I just updated for clarity, and |hnote#=. Templates, like {{Monster}} used there, are very specific, syntactic, and case sensitive. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 11:40, December 18, 2016 (EST)

Bulk Edits[edit]

Hey Shoe, thanks for the tips. I've re-read the minor edit page and I've found where I was getting caught up on whether or not or not it should be minor. Apologies for any trouble that caused. I do have a question about the bulk edits, though. When I was fixing the DDO Store page, clicking edit at the top did not bring up the entire page, and most of the entries had to be changed manually. When I went to edit the guild page, I assumed it was the same concept, hence the massive amount of edits. Looking over it now I see that the edit found at the top of that page would have allowed me to just ctrl + f and replace almost every instance with a single edit. Is there a way to tell whether or not it can be bulk edited other than manually checking each time? Again, sorry for any trouble I caused and thanks for your help! Abolisher (ContribsMessage) 17:15, January 11, 2017 (EST)

  • You can always edit the whole page in one shot... Look for the Read | Edit | Page History | ... links at the top of the page and click on Edit which should open the whole page for editing (instead of the little edit links for each section). Alternatively, you can use the keyboard shortcut of Alt+ Shift+E to open the page in edit mode... There are very few pages that don't work that way. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 22:19, January 11, 2017 (EST)

moving around of Wall of Wood and similar[edit]

My understanding of the release notes is different. When reaper was introduced, some items from that pack started to drop without some enhancements (probably because those items have N/H/E version, but they didn't have a reaper version, so items pulled on reaper were missing some enchantments). Now they are fixing it - players can upgrade they incomplete items in the stone of change. TL;DR: Imho there's no need for any history business (even if, it should probably only apply to HE and EE versions of the items).--Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 10:50, March 14, 2017 (EDT)

Yeah, that's my understanding as well - items are currently dropping as broken, and they are putting in a method to fix them; they're not actually changing the items. "Outdated" was probably the wrong word to use in the notes. - LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 21:17, March 14, 2017 (EDT)
  • I'll have to research the issue then. I was under the impression there were new "updated" versions of the item like when they updated all the GH/Abbot gear to use the seals. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 00:46, March 15, 2017 (EDT)

Template:Named Item[edit]

I know this is a work in progress, and has been for a while (and the coding challenges are above me) - but you are aware that all named item pages now list Minimum Level = 20, and have for several days, right? Wondering, if ETA is not "soon", whether temporarily going back to using old template might be an idea while new one is sandboxed toward functionality? Or whatever the best short-term fix might be. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 19:22, March 30, 2017 (EDT)

  • Nope, I wasn't aware of that. This is the first report. Like I said on our Discord chat server, please report any bugs with the changes as soon as you see them and I'll take care of it as quick as possible. I'm now on mobile until Sunday night, but I know exactly what would cause that. I'll try to fix it now, but it may have to wait until Sunday night because it's not worth reverting 4,000 pages with 1-3 edits each. Thanks for letting me know, just wish it was in the first 24 hours when I was home on computer. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 19:44, March 30, 2017 (EDT)
  • Done last night. The |epic= won't work until I get home, but that was better than most items showing wrong ML. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 08:19, March 31, 2017 (EDT)
  • Hi, regarding Template:Items by equipment slot; would it make sense to extend it to cosmetic armor and cosmetic headwear? Or quiver? --Cru121
    • Yep, already on my todo list. I want to get the existing stuff all working and updated to the new system before I start adding in the new stuffs. :) Since you're not on our Discord chat server, I went through and got all the categories working again last night. |epic= is the only thing still not working, and I've no intention of fixing that for a little while. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 08:41, April 3, 2017 (EDT)

Hey - re "...just wish it was in the first 24 hours..." - I would have, but there was this big "WORK IN PROGRESS" sign on the page, so I took that at face value and figured you were already on it. Won't assume next time. (Btw, you were just working on the Racial Enhancments template while I was on the Enhancements articles - thought I'd broken it somehow. Phew!) Later daze! C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 10:38, April 3, 2017 (EDT)

  • Hi dee ho, there's some misalignment between T:named item and T:named shield, resulting in MDB and Damage not populating. I think I fixed the MDB thing in the shield template, and failed to fix the damage thing. I probably could fix it, but I don't know your master plan here and I don't want to mess with the templates too much. --Cru121
  • Hi there, seems some other stats are not properly displaying either like Durability, even thou it is given. Example : Item:Dwarven_Brawler's_Wraps. SisAmethyst (ContribsMessage) 17:32, July 21, 2017 (EDT)

Solo only raids[edit]

Quest articles that include the parameters solo only and raids are listed as Solo only Raids in Category:DDO Compendium. This probably requires a fix in Template:Compendium phantom. --Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 06:42, April 12, 2017 (EDT)

  • Thanks. I'm still working on a major overhaul of all of the Quest/Item/etc pages and how they interact with each other. I'll be sure to make sure that's working right when I get to it. :) I'm assuming that you mean if the parameters are empty but exist. Shouldn't be too hard of a fix. :) ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 13:15, April 12, 2017 (EDT)

Conflict with new monster 'Flare'[edit]

In the new quest Third Time's a Charm there is an optional elemental named Flare. I've added all the other bosses in this quest but there is already a page named Flare that I don't want to overwrite. Not sure how to handle this situation, do we need to make a disambiguation page for him? Aeranda (ContribsMessage) 20:31, July 14, 2017 (EDT)

  • I've moved the hireling page and created a disambiguation page in its place. You can create a new page for the elemental. — Zav(T·C) 21:05, July 14, 2017 (EDT)

Spell resistance changes[edit]

They may have updated the spell resistance numbers with the last update. It's been a while since I made a SR item.

I just made a level 10 cloak and the spell resistance is 13. Your tool reports it as 19.

Messed up links for Item categories[edit]

Was on the page of Item:Signet of the Silver Flame when I attempted to click on the link for the Dark Scarab Powder. But instead as I expected to bring me to the page of Item:Dark Scarab Powder it send me straight to Named quest rewards. So that was odd and I thought I try to get there from the other direction. So I went to the Necropolis page and clicked on the Necropolis Scarab powder collector link of Squire Rale and as well went to the Named quest rewards collection overview. Wouldn't be a big issue if those items but they arent. Ok I thought, maybe just because a collection is missing so I actually created the Category:Necropolis Scarab collectable a bit similar to Category:Emerald Claw Nugget reward_items however only including the section. This is rendering fine in teh Categorie istelf but it still don't show up. SisAmethyst (ContribsMessage) 18:11, October 1, 2017 (EDT)

  • Okay. So, the link you clicked on for Dark Scarab Powder actually is a section link that is suppose to go to Named quest rewards#Dark Scarab Powder (permalink) except that section (== Dark Scarab Powder ==) doesn't exist since Zav (Contribs • Message) modified the page with this edit to use Help:Extension:NiceCategoryList instead of being all typed out due to template inclusion size issues (IIRC). I'd value community feedback on how we should resolve the issue (which I'd be happy to carry out Tuesday morning on DDOwiki Talk).  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 20:45, October 1, 2017 (EDT)
    • Yes I saw that, which is why I thought creating a Category for those items would foul the NCL to actually include it, but while it shows the content on the page itself, it also state on the bottom line This category currently contains no pages or media. . As such I guess it will not be included as it is considered empty. So as I see it there are three options: 1. we add (like in the past) elements that are not part of the category manually to this page, with the risk it will be cluttered again like before. 2. we actually add those items to the created category, so that they show up but then they may not be groupped by the scarab powder. 3. we create a dedicated page for reward items that are not directly quest related. SisAmethyst (ContribsMessage) 14:41, October 2, 2017 (EDT)
    • Just tried this and added manually the category to Lumric's Longbow and voila it shows up. Not with the item, but now at least the category name itself is listed. Question thou, why does an item like Blood's_Bellows show up in the category of Category:Emerald_Claw_Nugget_reward_items by itself and as such be visible in Named quest rewards ? SisAmethyst (ContribsMessage) 15:16, October 2, 2017 (EDT)

Monsters: same name, different identity[edit]

I was updating CRs for some of the monsters in the Servants of the Overlord quests, and noticed issues of overlap between those quests and the Stromvauld's Mine quests:

  • same name, different CR, different graphic, (possibly different powers?), same MM entry: Drow Wizard
  • same name, different CR, different graphic, (possibly different powers?), different MM entry: Drow Warrior
  • same name, different CR, same graphic?, (possibly different powers?), no MM entry: Jarilith (vs Ruins of Gianthold)

These differences cause problems for the CR extractor on quests. One solution would be to split the entries. Something like: Drow Warrior (Stromvauld%s Mine) and Drow Warrior (Web of Chaos). Possibly also Drow Warrior (Forgotten Realms) as the Forgotten Realms / Underdark drow use different graphics to the Eberron drow - I don't know if their powers or CR differ. Disambiguation pages could link the versions.

PS: you made an error when cleaning up the Drow Wizard - CR 20 is normal hard in Servants of the Overlord, not epic hard. Leaving it unfixed until we figure how to represent this.

Nom (ContribsMessage) 22:47, November 5, 2017 (EST)

  • I'd think a single page is sufficient. Simply add multiple sections if they're multiple monster entities with the same name in different locations (as long as the entities are indeed different and not the same entity in multiple places). CRs don't belong in hnotes, they belong in the CR section. If it's actually two different monsters, then it should have been indicated as such. I simply moved all the CRs up the page to the correct section. Since there was a CR for HH that was in line with the HN and HE I assumed, like has happened many times before, that it was meant to be EH for the CR. Also, I'm thinking about redoing the monster template to allow for multiple CR values based on quest level. I'm guessing there is a formula, but I've not had time to work it out yet.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 22:58, November 5, 2017 (EST)
What would you consider "two different monsters"? Obviously, the Drow Warrior in Servants of the Overlord is the same as for The Spinner of Shadows (same CR, same abilities, same graphic). But what about:
Some games have the same monster at varying power levels. As far as I can tell, DDO usually has a single "instance" of each monster, varying only by difficultly level (with the exception of some of the festival quest monsters, which seem to exist at fully scaling CRs). This makes me think that the different "Drow Warriors" are all "different" monsters that happen to have the same name text. Which suggests to me that they should have different Wiki entries, if we can solve the name disambiguation issue.
Nom (ContribsMessage) 00:49, November 6, 2017 (EST)
PS: the comment about the Drow Wizard was evidence that the current mechanism is confusing when the game re-uses monster names, not a complaint about the edit. :)
  • I'm going to say that different graphics is probably two different monsters. This is most likely to occur in cases where it's the same monster in two different realms. That said, there are monsters known to have different graphics and definitely being the same monster (eg Arraetrikos), so I'm not sure. I've asked for more data and opinions/thoughts of the matter on DDOwiki's Discord chat server. Feel free to pop over there and see if you can't encourage more discussion on the topic as well.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 17:11, November 6, 2017 (EST)
A related issue is that the automatic CR lookup for quest tables breaks if the "same" monster exists in different quests. To me, the quest -> monster linking seems the most useful part of the process.
  • Workaround: create a separate monster page when the CR differs. However, there's been a pushback against doing this.
  • Fix: add a 'hcrN' entry to the MM habitat mechanism, that allows a custom CR entry for a particular quest. The purist in me thinks that cleanest way to do this is allow multiple CR lines under CR (e.g. cr1, cr2, ...) and then allow the habitat entries to cross reference them. This makes it very easy to see that (say) Wolf exists with two different CR versions, and then the habitats can pick the version they want. It also means that (say) updating heroic hard CR for wolf in Disciples of Shar also updates it for Escape Plan, which is (a) usually desirable and (b) how all the other pages work. I looked into doing this myself but am not familiar enough with the template language.
  • Alternative: some sort of "variants" sub-entry for monsters to handle different CRs / pictures / etc that can be auto-linked back to the main monster page.
Nom (ContribsMessage) 16:18, November 29, 2017 (EST)

User Rien[edit]

Why did you feel the need to rename her userpage without her consent and against her express desires? It doesn't matter *who* she is, you have absolutely NO RIGHT to rename somebody else's account without permission. Please return her account name back to "Rien", as she prefers immediately. LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 21:04, December 12, 2017 (EST)

  • As noted in the edit summary, she requested the rename. I'd be happy to change it back if she'd like to request it. The categorization needs to stay on the page in some form though.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 21:11, December 12, 2017 (EST)
  • In fact... I'm frustrated and annoyed that she's complaining through other editors again instead of resolving her issue herself with a rename that she requested. I'm leaving it up to another list of 7 Bureaucrats to deal with as I've indicated in the #administrators'-noticeboard channel of our Discord chat server
Technical_13 - Today at 9:18 PM
@Bureaucrat would one of you like to deal with the "Lynn" situation.  I'm frustrated that she's complaining about the rename that she asked for.  The categorization needs to stay on the page; it's a confirmed account.  If she wants to make another account that isn't confirmed, I'm fine with that as well.  Thanks.
 👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 21:21, December 12, 2017 (EST)
  • YOU tagged her as SSG, and YOU renamed her account, against her specific requests. She wants to rename anonymous, and that's HER choice, not YOURS. - LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 21:35, December 12, 2017 (EST)
    • She confirmed the account. She requested the rename. She's welcome to make a new account named U:Rien and not confirm it. Please see specifically "Wikipedia offers wide latitude to users to manage their user space as they see fit. Nevertheless, they are not personal homepages, and are not owned by the user. They are part of Wikipedia and must serve its primary purposes; in particular, user talk pages make communication and collaboration among editors easier. These functions must not be hampered by ownership behavior." -- Unless we have an overriding policy (which we do not), that's the standard we use here as well.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 21:41, December 12, 2017 (EST)
      • That's... not confirmation. That's correction of information. Lynnabel is not a former intern, she's a current intern. But she specifically wants to keep her wiki account anonymous. And that page also says "Usually others will not edit your user page itself, other than to address significant concerns (rarely) or to do routine housekeeping, such as handling project-related tags, disambiguating links to pages that have been moved, removing the page from categories meant for articles, or removing obvious vandalism and/or BLP violations." I see nothing in this list that suggests adding any categories, especially against the user's own wishes (unless you care to add "outing SSG staff against their wishes" as an official project). And rather than having a bureaucratic editing war over a user's namespace, I suggest you leave it as the user requests until and unless another bureaucrat weighs in on the subject. As for the claim that she requested the namechange... she not only denies it but has requested that it be changed back to Rien. And the only reason I posted here when she requested it of me, as a bureaucrat, is that I apparently don't possess that power. LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 21:52, December 12, 2017 (EST)
        • Took a lot of unnecessary work, but I believe it is now resolved.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 21:54, December 12, 2017 (EST)
          • I'm not sure why you said she lost her editing history, it's all right here where it should be. That new account doesn't have a history yet. However, I'll graciously leave the permission flag because she doesn't need to go through the CAP.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 22:16, December 12, 2017 (EST)


As far as your claim you don't have the power to rename, DDO:Bureaucrats says you should and Special:ListGroupRights confirms that you do. Can you show me what you get when you try to do a rename that makes you think you can't? Feel free to test on Special:RenameUser/Example  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 21:57, December 12, 2017 (EST)

  • I get the options to Delete, Protect, or Refresh. No "Move". For that matter, I don't even get "Move" on my own namespace. I do get it on other pages I checked at random. LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 21:59, December 12, 2017 (EST)
    • "move" is not "rename" -- the link to rename a user should be in the "Page Toolbox" in the sidebar as well as at the top of the contributions page for the user.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 22:11, December 12, 2017 (EST)

AoV enhancement icons[edit]

Note that non-login user is me. I put the icons on AoV because texts are not quit visible which spells I can acquire when I just read them, even if the icon is different from actual enhancement icon we both know. that's why I put new icons near the existed icons. For example, Seeing the icon Icon Enhancement Ascendancy Healing Word.png makes me think of Sovereign Host Symbol or Unyielding Sovereignty, not Cure Light Wounds. other people may think same. other icons are same all, thinking different.

by the way, just revising was ok if you think that's better, but protecting the page when you revised 2 times made me quit unpleasurable with my thought that you think all of non-login users are potentially bad for contributing page as if doing Vandalism. of course we had lack of talk and that's my fault, but protecting the page was seen as if you deny my intention to make the page better, not acceptable. again, revising was ok though you might be bothered to do 2 times, but protecting was quit unpleasurable.

thanks. -- Targal (ContribsMessage) 00:23, January 19, 2018 (EST)

My two cents, having the spell icons is unnecessary. The spells are clearly listed in the description. LrdSlvrhnd (ContribsMessage) 00:56, January 19, 2018 (EST)
  • I've reformatted the table on the Angel of Vengence page in what I hope is a clearer way. I agree that the linked spell names in the description should be enough. The other issue is that "Sun Bolt" doesn't give you "Lightning Bolt", it gives you a "Sun Bolt" SLA etc. We can reformat it a little more, but that section of the page is already way too long IMHO. I guess we could put in collapsed sections for each different option since the only one that really matters is the one that you can get based on your religion, although I'm hesitant to collapse actual content in that way (it's generally not desirable). Feel free to pop on to our Discord chat server and we can have a discussion about it with some other editors and see if we can't figure out the best way to make it work for everyone (maybe we can work on it during DDOwiki Talk this week even to get more community feedback on it).  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 11:10, January 19, 2018 (EST)

Death House[edit]

Please undo your changes related to Death House quest.

  • "In the Shadow of the Castle" is the name of the first story arc in Ravenloft.
  • "In the Shadow of the Castle: Death House" is the name of the journal entry bestowed by chain giver to contact the quest giver. This journal entry does not have any monsters or named loot or anything.
  • The actual quest is called "Death House". Thanks. -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 01:25, March 14, 2018 (EDT)
  • I have only been out there once so far, and it looked like that was the name of the actual quest. Either way, it's certainly not "Dead House" like it was before I started making changes. I'll look into it more and make sure we get it right today. Thanks for letting me know. Smile  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 08:20, March 14, 2018 (EDT)

Everywhere I have seen the quest referenced, it was called Death House. Changing the name broke some links. The first one I noticed is that the quest loot is no longer being displayed on the Death House quest page. GregJ (ContribsMessage) 12:07, March 14, 2018 (EDT)

Legendary Tempest's Spine and Hound of Xoriat shared loot[edit]

The # of runes given out on these two quests is 64 on Normal/84 on Hard/125 on Elite and ALWAYS have been. The amounts have NEVER been variable despite the original Dev post regarding the rune system introduced in these two quests.

The same goes for the Baba and Strahd quests - 64/84/125...EVERY time.

Where do I add items to quest item lists?[edit]

I updated the Legendary Giant's Platter and when I went to the quest page where the platter is found (The Madness of Crowds) I could not figure where to add the platter or a link to the platter. I looked through the FAQ and did not find this information, please help :D

(oh, and btw the reCaptcha is broken. I dont know who needs to know this but im sure that you know who to tell)

  • Those tables take care of themselves in less than 24 hours usually. Looks like it caught up.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 19:17, April 14, 2018 (EDT)

Unlinked bestower[edit]

You've made some edits with the description: "unlink bestower because the template autolinks it". The edits would be fine if the template indeed autolinked it, which it most certainly does not. See {{Quest}} and the talk section where I discussed the exact same issue... Template talk:Quest#Bestower Faltout (ContribsMessage) 12:51, May 12, 2018 (EDT)

  • You should have talked to me before reverting all my edits... and waited for a response... It was a WIP... See Free to Play quests  which was brought to my attention because of its talk page... You will see that your reversion of my edits have broken all the bestower links because they were indeed already autolinked there.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:54, May 12, 2018 (EDT)
    • You should have said something in the appropriate talk page (linked above) before removing the links from a small portion of the quests. It's not unheard of to take on a project and leave it midway. Also, the last time you commented on this topic (links for the bestower), you said that bestower in the template should be left unlinked because of edge cases where the bestower is not an NPC. Since then, a couple of quests have had their bestower updated and not necessarily an NPC. So now that you changed your mind and you want bestower linked, you just broke a bunch of quest pages.
      Bottomline: Please correct all the pages that use |bestower= or revert the change to {{MissionInfoBox}} and give the free quests the bestower link back. (Example of broken page: The Cloven-jaw Scourge: The Caverns of Shaagh) Either way, stop leaving the wiki in a broken state. Faltout (ContribsMessage) 16:50, May 12, 2018 (EDT)
      • I've reverted the autolinking in the missionbox info template. Bottom line is this: next time, talk to a person on their talk page before rolling back a few dozen pages and breaking things. Thanks.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 18:09, May 12, 2018 (EDT)


Hi, this is regarding the blocked IP editor. His/Her contribution on the talk page of Elyd Edge and Brine Shaman Staff are 100% valid and correct. Those weapons don't use charisma to damage (only to hit). The comment under relic map does sound rude though. Still I don't feel the actions were truly intimidating or harassing. Not sure if there were any additional edits by this editor, the contributions page does not show much. Or maybe the edit summaries were offensive? -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 00:42, May 17, 2018 (EDT)

  • They could have found a more constructive way to relate information. Being an IP editor just whining about things being broken or not the way they like them, especially telling an administrator who retired years ago to stop uploading maps was extremely offensive. I unchecked the boxes, so they can create an account and discuss it on their talk page - if they choose, but a short block was warranted.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 01:04, May 17, 2018 (EDT)

Spell usefulness[edit]

You are ruining the page. It is organized in spell levels per class (the numbered comments) and now it's just an incoherent list of spells, which is not useful to anyone. Change it back to the correct format please. Faltout (ContribsMessage) 16:15, July 10, 2018 (EDT)

  • Bring back spell levels pls. -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 07:33, July 11, 2018 (EDT)
  • I saw nothing indicating they were spell levels. I'll work on adding defined spell levels today, but there's still no reason to have empty rows and numbered comments that don't offer any information.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 08:14, July 11, 2018 (EDT)
    • Out of the dozens of contributors of that page, you were the only one to not understand that. Perhaps next time ask before changing stuff twice? In any case, the empty rows signify that there aren't any important spells at the indicated levels. If you don't like the numbered list format, perhaps change it to headers or bold or tables, but the empty spell levels should be kept empty to make it faster to understand and avoid confusion about whether someone forgot to add the missing levels. Faltout (ContribsMessage) 09:13, July 11, 2018 (EDT)
  • Updated to include levels. There should be no empty levels, the page is long enough as it is. Perhaps it needs to be deleted and just let each section be on the appropriate class page instead? DDOstream (ContribsMessage) 10:15, July 11, 2018 (EDT)


This new thing, it is bad. Please let's keep the old short overview as the default view - maybe move the new overwhelming DPL to a separate article. -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 07:33, July 11, 2018 (EDT)

  • All NCL is being converted to DPL because NCL isn't compatible with the next version of MW that we want to upgrade to. We can make a shorter DPL display, but it'll need to be DPL.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 08:16, July 11, 2018 (EDT)
    • Repeating the plea regarding using T:Named items category on pages like C:Intelligence items. and similar. This is really a bad idea. The old T:Category listing loaded much faster AND offered much more interesting information than this long useless list we have now. It's actually better to have an empty page there instead of T:Named item category.
I can see T:Named item category being useful on subcategories like C:Wisdom +19 items. But definitely not on the main category. -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 14:15, August 22, 2018 (EDT)
  • Help:Extension:NiceCategoryList2 is going away with the next MW core update. {{Category listing}} is going away. Also, it was requested on livestream today by the viewers for me to make the rest of the categories use the nice sortable table because it is much more useful than the old list. Using {{Named items category}} offers a LOT more valuable information than just a list of pages. Shows ML, enhancements, drop locations, and is sortable. If it's useful on subcats like Wisdom +19 items  it's just as (or more) useful on the parent cat like Wisdom items  as it lets you scroll down through and find the best Wisdom +## item for your current level and compare against the other effects. As far as load times go, the page is cached daily, and shouldn't take all that long to load once cached.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 16:25, August 22, 2018 (EDT)
  • I can probably work on something to update {{Category listing}} to use DPL instead of NCL. The issue with DPL is that it has a max results number of 500. Several categories have more pages than that. I'm not sure the tables are useless since they allow you to sort by ML and see what items exist at each level range. I think loading can be made faster if I add |allowcachedresults=true Faltout (ContribsMessage) 17:23, August 22, 2018 (EDT)

NPC Template hiccup[edit]

The "Location" line for NPC's seems borked. All NPC pages currently displays brackets around the written location, and sometimes double-displays w/ a "Category" tag (e.g. Baudry Cartamon, Arman Argentine). Beyond my wiki-fu to troubleshoot. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 22:20, July 20, 2018 (EDT)

  • See Template talk:NPC#Recent change to location. From what I can tell, the plan is to actually update 1000 NPC pages. Tech13 has already updated about 30 pages in the last 3 days. If he keeps that pace, he'll be done in 97 days. And then we'll have that super useful information like Category:Power Play Artificer trainers. Who knew there were artificer trainers inside quests?! :) Faltout (ContribsMessage) 04:34, July 21, 2018 (EDT)
  • The reason for that is because people hard linked the location for NPCs instead of just typing in the location and letting the template link them. I'm working on it. If it takes 3 month to fix, so-be-it (it won't).  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 07:38, July 21, 2018 (EDT)
    • Well, it now has been 3 months and still half the NPC pages are broken. What's more, you were not working on it. Meander (Contribs • Message) did all the work and it still wasn't enough. You made a template change noone agreed with, broke about a thousand pages and then you did nothing to fix that. That's not what administrators are for. Faltout (ContribsMessage) 13:54, October 24, 2018 (EDT)

DDO Stream youtube address goes to video 93 (Feb 2018)[edit]

Hi, I see these live events (which I can't join during work) as comment address links to watch after the event. The address provided goes up to posting #93/94 (Feb 2018). Will more be posted? meander (ContribsMessage) 14:14, August 22, 2018 (EDT)

  • We had episode 117 today, I just haven't been able to keep up with uploading the archives to YouTube. I'll try to set some time aside for that soon.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 16:19, August 22, 2018 (EDT)
    • Ok! My first assumption is always that I am a bonehead and missing something obvious. Looking forward to checking out the episodes. Thanks- meander (ContribsMessage) 18:40, August 22, 2018 (EDT)

Wiki Navigation Header[edit]

... is suddenly MIA? Scanned "recent changes", nothing jumped out. C-Hound (talk) 17:11, December 19, 2018 (EST)

Understood, thanks - it is what it is. It was up for a couple/few days, down again as of today. You pro'ly know this, just stating for the record. C-Hound (talk) 07:30, December 28, 2018 (EST)
Success - grats! Musta been a biatchuh. Do we know if this is this going to be stable now? C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 12:22, January 6, 2019 (EST)

You probably noticed already, but we lost this again as of sometime Monday AM. C-Hound (talk) 13:26, July 8, 2019 (EDT)

Your re-edit of Barovian Regalia[edit]

This robe does not provide Potency bonus at all. It provides an Exceptional bonus to Universal Spell Power which stacks with Exceptional Potency or Exceptional Elemental Spell Powers similar to how an Implement provides an Equipment bonus to USP and stacks with Equipment bonuses to Potency and Elemental Spell Power. As such, there is no Template for it to follow, AFAIK. — previous unsignedIcon tooltip.pngPlease sign posts using ~~~~ comment by (d| r| b) at 21:36, September 18, 2019 (UTC)

  • So while your explanation is hypothetical, because there are IIRC no Exceptional Potency items in the game, Exceptional Universal Spell Power indeed does stack with (for example) Exceptional Devotion. I have now updated Template:SpellPower to allow Universal Spell Power as a parameter. As for spell lore, I am not sure if we have other sources of Exceptional bonuses to Spell Critical chance. If not, then we don't really have to differentiate between Exceptional Spell Lore and Exceptional Universal Spell Lore. Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 02:16, April 30, 2019 (EDT)

Odd categorization[edit]

With respect, in what sense is C:Templates a maintenance category? It's hardly true that, "This category may be empty occasionally or even most of the time." Hoopy Froodle (ContribsMessage) 21:44, July 19, 2019 (EDT)

  • A maintenance category contains pages that are not articles, or it groups articles by status rather than subject. A category of templates for DDOwiki is not about DDO, so it falls into the maintenance category classification.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 10:49, July 22, 2019 (EDT)

Movember 2019[edit]

Heya Tech, you wanted my total for last year? 347 and some change. You Moving this year? I am moving for men's mental health. Debating joining the SSG team or just meandering on my own. Also trying to talk some guildies into getting off their duffs and joining me =). meander (ContribsMessage) 15:21, October 7, 2019 (EDT)

Legendary Twisted Missile not showing up on related pages[edit]

Hey ShoeMaker, thank you for the welcome!

I have a bit of a problem with a page I created actually. It's for an item that drops in the Soul Survivor dungeon, however despite linking the item to Soul Survivor and tagging it as a Dart weapon I haven't been able to get it to appear in either sections for Soul Survivor loot  or Named Darts  item listings, even after refreshing the database. Any idea what I could be doing wrong? Thanks. Page in question: Legendary Twisted Missile — previous unsignedIcon tooltip.pngPlease sign posts using ~~~~ comment by Dieby ( c |d| r| b) at 13:14, October 23, 2019 (UTC)


Greetings, Technical 13! -- ShadowBolt (ContribsMessage) 09:23, January 23, 2020 (EST)

Recent plague of spambots[edit]

Seems every day, or several times a day, we're getting a slew of a dozen fake accounts, and one (or more) of them then posts some automated advertising trash (once even in cyrillic!). "Block User" and {instantDelete} are making my fingers hurt. Any chance we can block that IP number? It's all the same, except for the rare actual user who signs up at the same time. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 18:06, January 30, 2020 (EST)

Sudden edit warning on User page[edit]

Hey - I went to edit my User/"Wiki Code" page today, and received a Warning (2, actually) that I have never seen before. They were immediately under the standard "This is only a Preview..." warning at the top of the Edit page, and, similar to that, were in red:

Warning: U:C-Hound/Wiki Code is calling T:Tl with more than one value for the "2" parameter. Only the last value provided will be used.
Warning: U:C-Hound/Wiki Code is calling T:Tl with more than one value for the "1" parameter. Only the last value provided will be used.

I had edited the page earlier in the day, and so tried to roll back those edits - and returned it to its original state (Nov '19), but the warning persists. Which would make me think maybe something else got tweaked on a meta/code level behind the scenes, but nothing jumps out in "recent edits" (and "recent" could be anything since November). So... it's beyond my Wiki-fu, but it's still garishly annoying. Solution/workaround, or learn to ignore? I don't edit it often, but it bothers me to know "something is not right" on that page. Feel free to play w/ the page if that helps. C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 19:18, March 10, 2020 (EDT)

  • It's part of the most recent MW core update. I'll see if I can't find the offender(s) and correct them for you. :)  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 18:00, March 11, 2020 (EDT)
  • And you suceeded! I had a suspicion that it might have been far upstream from us, something in @WikiCode or such. Thank you! C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 16:28, March 12, 2020 (EDT)

Template:Quest chain[edit]

Just think for a second. How are you going to link pages like this, with brackets, like this? Venus (ContribsMessage) 13:57, June 13, 2020 (EDT)

  • You don't have to. It's automatically always linked. There's no reason the chain should never be linked. If you need to do a piped link, only to remove disambiguative markers in that parameter, do it as:
    |chain=Menace of the Underdark (story arc)|Menace of the Underdark
     👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 09:52, June 15, 2020 (EDT)
  • {{Menace of the Underdark}} as an example:
{{Quest chain
  | Web of Chaos
  | Menace of the Underdark: The Darkening
  | dab2  = The Darkening
  | Menace of the Underdark: City of Portals
  | dab3  = City of Portals
  | Menace of the Underdark: The Queen of the Demonweb
  | dab4  = The Queen of the Demonweb
  | Caught in the Web
  | chain = Menace of the Underdark (story arc){{!}}Menace of the Underdark

Template:Web of Chaos[edit]

Have you ever seen/read Menace of the Underdark (story arc)? Venus (ContribsMessage) 13:58, June 13, 2020 (EDT)

  • Of course I have. Just because the quest was released in a different update doesn't mean it's not part of the chain. It's the capstone quest for the previous three quests that are required for flagging.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 09:55, June 15, 2020 (EDT)

Fallout from recent T:Quest changes?[edit]

Hey - Is it possible the recent changes to Template:Quest contributed to this hiccup? C-Hound (ContribsMessage) 17:31, August 9, 2020 (EDT)

  • Anything is possible, but it's very unlikely. The database was having issues before that change. Hopefully Xevo has had some time to look into it and fix the issues.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 08:45, August 11, 2020 (EDT)

Sorrowdusk broken and Discord link expired[edit]

Sorrowdusk page is broken and the discord link expired — previous unsignedIcon tooltip.pngPlease sign posts using ~~~~ comment by (d| r| b) at 10:34, August 10, 2020 (UTC)

Wilderness Zone monster table standard?[edit]

So, I was looking at some Wilderness Zone pages, seeking to help improve and complete things, but now I'm a little confused. I haven't looked at every single Wilderness Zone page yet, but I am noticing a major divergence in how some of them set up their monster tables. For example, pages like The_Cerulean_Hills and Tangleroot_Gorge have auto-compiled monster tables just like what you would find in most quests. As far as I can telll, the coding for this is {{:Category:Monsters in <zone>}} But pages like Sands_of_Menechtarun and Three-Barrel_Cove_(heroic) have manually-entered monster tables. As I haven't checked all other wilderness zone pages yet, I don't know if there are yet more styles of doing it. So, my question is: Is there actually any one specific style that -all- Wilderness Zone pages -should- follow for their monster lists, and if so, can you point out one that would serve as a good example to model all other Wilderness Zone monster sections on? TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 18:07, September 13, 2020 (EDT)

  • Auto-compiled monster tables just like what you would find in most quests is preferred. That way the table is always as up to date as possible and we only have to edit the monster pages themselves. If you post a message on DDOstream (Contribs • Message)'s talk page, I will try to make an example on stream this week.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 08:49, September 14, 2020 (EDT)
  • Hmm, I don't think I will need an eample on DDOstream (and many not be able to attend regardless), but...I do have another question. So, I have noticed that when creating a creature page for instance just using the standard creature template, the creature page is automatically included in various categories based on its template entries. Particularly, for every <habitat> that is added to a creature page, the creature is added to a category that says "Monsters in <habitat>". For Wilderness Zones like Sands of Menechtarun, it has multiple Slayer quests that are tracked separately based on which enemies you kill. I just tested something, so I know the base coding of the auto-categorization and auto-compiling tables does not work this way currently, but...could it be possible, at some point in the future, to alter the coding of the auto-categorization/auto-compiling to allow for monsters that belong to a specific Slayer quest be included in a separate table for that list, rather than a single table for everything? For example, instead of having the code {{:Category:Monsters in Sands of Menechatrun}} for a single auto-compiled table for every creature in the zone, have three separate tables with the codes {{:Category:Gnolls of Menechtarun}}, {{:Category:Scorrow of Menechtarun}}, and {{:Category:Undead of Menechtarun}}? For each individual creature page, obviously, most likely they will need to have some sort of tag or marker manually added that signifies which of the categories they fall into (since more than just Gnoll-types belong to the "Gnolls of Menectarun" Slayer, more than just Scorrow-types belong to the "Scorrow of Menechtarun" Slayer, and so on...), beneath the general umbrella of "Monsters in Sands of Menechtarun". But does this sound like something that could be done in the future? TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 12:05, September 14, 2020 (EDT)
    • If I understand what you're asking, what you really want is a parameter in {{Monsters in quest}} that will allow you to specify a type or race to refine filtering by the template? That template was not actually intended for slayer areas, but it's been adapted to it and works okay - I could create a new template for more specific filtering for your use case.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:21, September 14, 2020 (EDT)
    • Eh....sort of but not quite? Actually, on second thought, I should probably spend more time getting familiar with the structure of the auto-compiling table coding myself so I can be more accurate and specific about what I'm thinking of. May revisit this line of inquiry some time in the future, but for now, I do know all I need to know, and that is simply to update Wilderness Zone pages with manually-listed monsters to use an auto-compiled table instead. For now, go ahead and forget about this coding question, I know you have so many other much more important projects on the wiki to keep on top of. Thank you for your help and attention though! TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 18:54, September 14, 2020 (EDT)

All monsters now support a hslayN entry (works the same as hnoteN) that can be used to designate the 'slayer' group they are part of on a particular wilderness map. It's a little clunky, because (as currently implemented) it requires an explicit entry for each monster, even if there's only one slayer group and most/all monsters are part of that group. Monsters that are not part of a slayer group can have their entry set to '-' (default behaviour is that a lack of group => undefined). To make this work better for ambient creatures that appear on multiple maps (e.g. foxes & deer), setting the top level property 'slayer = -' will set the default slayer value for that monster to '-'. Nom (ContribsMessage) 21:06, September 19, 2021 (EDT)

Transition to DPL3 extension[edit]

Given the transition towards using the DPL3 extension and no plans on reverting mentioned by Xevo Named_items_category, I'm not sure I understand the value in leaving in the dplcache references in the macros (or templates). I see completely removing (not leaving commented) the dplcache parameter as providing two benefits. 1) Readability. It's easier to read the code at a glance, and makes the pages narrower and shorter without the inline comments and commented out lines/clutter. 2) Less overhead/code to process when generating the page (the impact of the extra processing required so little as to not make any real difference, but wanted to mention this.)

What do you propose the value is of leaving the parameters in if there is no intent on ever moving to the dpl extension that uses that parameter? Joenuts (ContribsMessage) 14:58, October 5, 2020 (EDT)

  • I haven't had the opportunity to see if there is a suitable replacement for the dplcache feature. I noticed there seems to be a cacheperiod parameter that may serve to replace dplcache with an appropriate time frame to override how often the cache is refreshed. We've also had some interactive talk with Xevo himself on this transition on our Discord chat server server. Feel free to pop in and check it out. If it turns out there is nothing to be done with the dplcache parameter, I can run through with DDO:AWB and remove them in a matter of minutes later.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 07:48, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
    • I don't know what's going on, but I've just noticed something weird, and whatever is happening here is the only thing I can guess might be the cause. Before, monster DPL tables were organized by color first, then alphabetically (That is, all purples listed first in alphabetical, then reds listed in alphabetical, then oranges listed in alphabetical, then finally all others). Suddenly, every monster DPL table is by default listed -strictly- alphabetically, with no regards to color at all. I really really DO NOT LIKE this and very much want the monster DPL tables to be by-default listed by color first again. Can this be done? TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 10:55, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
      • I have noticed this problem as soon I fixed the issue with the dplcache parameter in T:Monsters in quest. Also, the color ordering is not the only issue present. These tables are not respecting the 100% width anymore since the DPL update. MrLizard (ContribsMessage) 11:06, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
      • That shouldn't be related to DPL directly. That should all html5/css3 compliance issues. I'll see what I can do when I have a moment.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:33, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
        • Looks like I have the width issue solved - it just needed a space in there. As far as the default tablesortcol sorting - still no idea BUT at least manual sorting works when you click the headers by column. /shrug  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:54, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
          • Yeah, the "default" sorting is still the disorganized non-color sort, so I hope that can be fixed eventually. But another issue I've discovered; while it is possible to get things to sort back into color by clicking the header on the table, this puts them into a -backwards- sort; that is to say, when they are sorted properly by color with colors at the top, going purple-red-orange-rest, they are sub-sorted by REVERSE alphabetical order, and when sorted in proper alphabetical order, they are sorted in -reverse- color (rest-orange-red-purple). It's not possible to get them properly sorted into the form "sort by colors at the top, then sub-sort by ascending alphabetical order" that is the desired standard. TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 13:05, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
            • I noticed the reverse alphabetical thing when sorting as well - I can do something about this later - doesn't seem too big of a deal at this time.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 13:09, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
    • ...and I have just noticed another, -far bigger- problem. Beneath the DPL tables, there is no longer the option to force-refresh the table. That is a feature that i CRUCIALLY RELY ON when I am running through quests and adding missing CRs to mobs, and I refresh the DPL table once at the end of the run (I never over-used it, as per the warning message that came with it) to verify that I actually got everything and that it is properly visible. I don't know where it went, but this feature must also return, please. TheWarforgedArtificer (ContribsMessage) 12:38, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
      • That's related to there no longer being a dplcache parameter and there's nothing we can do about it at this time. I will research to understand the extension better and see if I can figure out/create a workaround for this.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:43, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
        • Maybe refreshing the page (in the 'More' tab) result in the same effect? I've read somewhere that the dpl cache is now handled by mediawiki (I am not sure what this means though) MrLizard (ContribsMessage) 12:52, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
          • Yes, refreshing the page seems to work.  👟 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message) 👟 12:54, October 6, 2020 (EDT)
            • Tested and confirmed myself as well. Yep, this will suffice. 13:35, October 6, 2020 (EDT)

ad: Template:Merge[edit]

So, where I can find a list of templates, like this? Venus (ContribsMessage) 14:52, March 3, 2021 (EST)

Monster entries without pics page is not refreshing[edit]

Shoemaker, I've noticed that the page is not refreshing when a picture has been uploaded to an entry. The page currently says "501 entries" while I randomly checked 4 of them and 3 have pictures... Is there something wrong with the page, or something else? I wanted you to have a heads-up. Respond, if you can, on my talk page. GMTrojan (ContribsMessage) 13:13, June 3, 2021 (EDT)

Named item template the 3rd?[edit]

Hi, you are probably still tinkering with the named item template. The thing is I tried to update the Epic Chimera's Fang to include the information as we now have a legendary crafting option for it. However, it doesn't show up at all, probably because it is already flagged as epic and then doesn't trigger the crating option? I do know that the epic crafting section needs a revamp to include the U50 changes though. SisAmethyst (ContribsMessage) 19:04, August 24, 2021 (EDT)

Javascript changes[edit]

Stop changing the scripts that load for all users without the ability to disable them. I do not trust your coding skills or intentions at all and I can't disable javascript for ddowiki because the tables and other stuff will stop working. Stop messing with the wiki's javascript for no reason AT ALL. Faltout (ContribsMessage) 03:01, September 18, 2021 (EDT)

Lammania: False Positives on Images[edit]

Resolved in diff 501062, diff 501078, and with {{isLamannia}}

I'm not totally sure how, but one of the Javascript edits you've made recently has started flagging every image on the wiki (and I mean every image) as being based on Lammania previews. I don't suppose you could undo that particular one? PurpleSerpent (ContribsMessage) 14:41, September 22, 2021 (EDT)

T:Anchor broken?[edit]

Resolved in diff 501099

Some changes, probably related T:Anchor, resulted in some strange links manifesting on the page Domain and possibly elsewhere. -- Cru121 (ContribsMessage) 15:49, September 22, 2021 (EDT)

T:InGroup user lists[edit]

Hi! I've noticed you've been making a few edits to T:InGroup recently. While you're at it, could you fix the links on that page so they actually link to the list of users for that group? For the "administrators" link, for example, the list you get isn't sorted by group, so you see the first 18 users, not the first 18 admins. This probably isn't a priority, but I find it annoying. PurpleSerpent (ContribsMessage) 15:48, October 25, 2021 (EDT)

Game Revision Dates[edit]

Thought I should just point out that I've changed this template back to manually updated, because the template was only showing the most recent update regardless of the time it was given. PurpleSerpent (ContribsMessage) 09:28, January 25, 2022 (EST)