User talk:Borror0/Archive01

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DDOwiki Administrator Application

Ok, I'm hope I'm doing this right. I've read the wikiquette in order to do everything right, but wiki editing is pretty new to me. Forgive me if I do wrong.

So, I'd like to apply as the adimistrator of DDOwiki. I've always found the wiki to be an useful tool but, I've always felt it needed to be more complete, that there should be more effort put into it. I'm willing to but time into the wiki, as I see it has a real potential. I had started to write guides for my guildmates in order to help them as we often recruit newcomers that sympatic to us. For someone new, learning everything is really hard, that is why I had started those guides. Many times I wished I had access to a wiki format, that would have made all simplier.

When I saw the ad on the home page, I really started to think about it. Now I'm 100% sure that I'd like to help to make the wiki grow in order to make of it the biggest source about DDO as possible. I'm always willing to help people around me and I think this is the best way to do it. However,I have no knowledge of the wiki format. I can easy read it, but anyone can. I'm willing to learn, as long as someone is there to help me if I hit a wall.

I hope no one has been chosen yet. If so, I'll help him of my best, if not, I'll work really hard on the wiki. :) Borror0 06:54, June 25, 2007 (EDT)

You did it just fine - I'm moving it here, so you can easier follow the conversation (anytime there's a change to this page, you'll get a notice at the top of every page you visit on the wiki till you check it). As for the application - the biggest requirement I'm looking for is a combination of time and dedication, and you seem to have both. Regarding the wiki's editing syntax, well, it can be somewhat complicated to learn it all, but if there's anybody who knows it better than I, then I don't know who they are. So I'm not very worried about you being able to learn to make the wiki itself do what you want d-:

Bottom line is, I've already given your user account Superuser privileges, now let me see you edit for a little while - take some project that looks like it needs doing (say, cleaning up and standardizing the Spells, or updating all the Places with the changes from the latest update), and just start doing it! As soon as I and the other dev are convinced that you're really willing to take the place into your hands (and said hands are capable) we'll give you the final Sysop and Breaucrat user account privs, and privately contact you for information as to how and where we can direct advertising payment, or whether you'd just rather the advertisements be turned off.

One last thing to remember, is if at any time we think you aren't doing the site justice, we reserve the right to remove said privileges and to stop sending whatever revenue might be in question.

Looking forward to having you doing some good work around here! Mr. Cable 19:29, June 28, 2007 (EDT)

I will do my best, thanks a lot for beleiving in me. If you see anything that needs major changes, tell it to me. I'll try to work on everything that I see, but I might miss some topics. (This goes to everyone, if you have any suggestion, tell me.. or do it yourself.. ;-)I hope to do of this wiki the best DDO tool around.) Peerless, what is the best way to ask you questions about wiki format? Usertalk? Borror0 14,01, June 29, 2007 (EDT)

See the contact info note near the top of my user talk page (don't worry, you're not blind, I just added it d-:) Mr. Cable 16:01, June 29, 2007 (EDT)

I've watched you editing, and I think you're dedicated enough to hold the position, and brink this site back to life, so to speak. I've promoted your user account to this site's Steward, which gives you (way too many, hehe) extra powers. See Help:User_rights for a full list of what you can do (every permission from the top, down to those listed under Steward, are assigned to your account). Also, you may notice, you show up on Special:Listusers as a Steward now d-: Best of luck, and I'll be reaching you later regarding payment (not that there's very much of it right now). One last thing that isn't really mentioned on the rights page is that it's really up to you whether to display advertisements on the site - if you decide to disable them, of course, you won't get any money, any more than we will, but it will probably be a better experience for the user. Let me know which way you want it. elliottcable (talk, site) 01:41, July 9, 2007 (EDT)

I'm not here for the money, or I wouldn't be here at all. ;) I'm here to make the wiki a better for players, it's always nice to have a place to look for information when in doubt. I hope, once I've cleaned it up enough, that people will join in and add stuff and make it near perfect.

I'm glad to have Toad so far as he edits what I say and makes it clearer. XD

But, how about you Peerless, would you rather getting some money from the wiki? I guess there is fees to keep EnterWiki online, right? I don't find the adds really annoying, so I don't mind leaving them, and the idea to get money for my DDO subscription is nice. I'm studying chemistry right now, since I don't work when at school, DDO is a luxe. A luxe that pays for itself is inda tempting. Borror0 21:13, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

Money wise, this is nothing - I promised myself that I wouldn't put ads on the site just to run it. The only reason I've reneged on my deal with myself regarding ads, is to offer a better user experience - getting dedicated editors is difficult, and sometimes offering them a little money will help convince them to spend more time editing, you know? While it costs me to run the site, it also costs the administrators and editors time and effort to do just as much as I'm doing, so the idea is if the admin can give up his time editing and turn off ads, then I can give up whatever small cost it takes to run this and turn off ads. If that made sense. Really it comes down to this - without the ads, you may get bored and slow down editing, which would be bad for the users. If, however, it's paying for your bad DDO habit, then it's more likely that as long as you play the game, you'll continue to do whatever necessary on the wiki to keep being able to play d-: Depends what you think of your own perserverence, just let me know if you want me to toggle them off. You can even do it yourself, delete all the text on the MediaWiki:Gaacct page and replace it with a single dash ('-') to disable them. elliottcable (talk, site) 22:24, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

We'll see, not in a hurry anyway. Borror0 22:29, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

A Few Questions

PS: Did the wiki just went down? If so, why? Borror0

New captcha, should solve your problems, and help a good cause at the same time (log out, and try to add an external link to a page to see what I mean) elliottcable (talk, site) 22:30, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

No need to try, I guess it is impossible to, cuts the spammers.

But, pardon the newbness, what is a captcha? Oh, and what is the Sandbox? Borror0 22:39, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

Captcha - and the sandbox is just a page for editing randomly to test syntax and stuff: Sandbox elliottcable (talk, site) 22:48, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

PPS:A bit curious, I guess you created EnterWiki by your own, why did you create it? Others wiki seem dead, am I wrong? Borror0

Was just a stray idea, wanted to be able to have one central place for information - the idea was to have something like Wikipedia, but more granular; and like wikia, but more structured. Instead of being restricted to ONE page about dungeons and dragons online on wikipedia, you can create 5000 pages about dungeons and dragons online on the WikiWork (wiki network). Instead of one page about breast cancer, or even 100 pages about breast cancer, you could create a whole WIKI of information about breast cancer, but unlike Wikia, you could keep said wiki linked in tightly with other cancer information, and the cancer wikis closely linked with other medical information, and the medical wikis closely linked with other wikis of all sorts. I just haven't had the time to devote to developing the content and advertising it and getting people to work on it lately, due to other projects. elliottcable (talk, site) 22:35, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

PPPS: Can I add you to my MSN list, would ease communication when I got stupid/quick to answer question. :) Borror0

Yah, like I sad above, see the note at the top of my usertalk page (link in my signature) elliottcable (talk, site) 22:38, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

Just wanted to make sure it didn't bother you. :) Politness (is that a word?).→ Borror0 22:41, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

It's fine, don't worry about it. Give me a ping and add my accounts to whatever messengers you use, my info is there. elliottcable (talk, site) 23:00, July 11, 2007 (EDT)

Editing Skillz

Nice to see you picking up on the editing format so very fast! I love this range of edits lol. Just one tip incase you didn't realize it - you can follow every single edit of any sort anybody makes to the wiki, including me and yourself, on the recent changes special page - that way, if you want some help with editing, one thing you can do, is sort of follow me and others around the wiki. See how we make our changes, and try to figure out exactly what syntax we changed and why, you know? Once you've got the template substitution syntax down, you're mostly golden, though editing the templates themselves can be a NIGHTMARE. elliottcable (talk, site) 13:05, July 1, 2007 (EDT)

Hi Peerless, I've read a bit on "The DDO information project" page. I've read about "verified and official format, if I'd known I would have written it in the right format. Sorry about that, I'll goo and edit myself once I have some free time. My girlfriend has come to see (it has been a month since we've seen each other) and she'll stay home until next Friday, so you'll see that I won't edit much in the following days. Borror0 18:17, July 1, 2007 (EDT)

Post template

Just wanted to see if you'd picked up on the use of the {{post}} template on discussion pages - I don't know if I've written it up anywhere, but I thought it was pretty simple to use. Try it like this:

{{SUBST:Post|1=[level]|2=~~~~|3=
Content
}}

Where [level] is the level of the post - i.e. 0 for the first post in a discussion, or whatever the level of the post you're replying to is, plus one. 2 will expand into your signature as defined in your preferences, and 'Content' is where you put whatever you want to say.

If you're in a hurry, you can use this shortcut:

{{subst:p|[level]|Content}}

However, as you'll quickly notice, that breaks if your post has any complicated stuff in it (template substitutions, links, anything with an = mark, a few other things, all break it if I remember correctly). Hope that all made sense! elliottcable (talk, site) 00:22, July 9, 2007 (EDT)

Patrolling

You're mostly doing sweeping at the moment, which is fine, but I wanted to make sure that if you started RC patrol too, you knew to mark the edits you'd checked for accuracy/non-spam as patrolled - in the recent changes, there's exclamation points next to un-patrolled edits. If you follow the (diff) link to the edit itself, you'll see a link above the new half of the diff to '[Mark as patrolled]' - if the edit was correct or good in your opinion, click that link please - it saves me time later (I always patrol new edits to the wiki, and there'd be no point and you and I checking the same edits) d-: elliottcable (talk, site) 18:07, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

I'm actually patrolling at the moment, also, I check every update made to the web site and I patrol them when I see the "mark as patroled" link. :) The only editor I'm not 100% sure about his edits is Yoko, why is he removing all of this stuff and adding nothing? I'll have to hook him up. Borror0 18:11, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

Hmm I'm not sure. It looks like he's mostly targeting the Unique quest rewards and Unique chest loot pages, and over the last few months he's seemed to be mostly keeping them up to date. It's your call, dropping him a line and asking might be the best idea.

Regarding patrolling, this page might help you. At the moment it needs work on my part, but, well, it works d-: elliottcable (talk, site) 18:24, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

Header

Mr. Borror0, can I get a new link added to the top menu? I'd like to create a Glossary, and inhabit it, as I think nomenclature is a big stumbling block for some people. I saw a conversation today in the forums (General Discussion) in which someone tried to tell the general populace that PK means Player Killer and we shouldn't use it anywhere in DDO-land because you can't be a Player Killer in DDO. He was immediately informed that PK actually means Phantasmal Killer in DDO-land, but the thread proves that a glossary could be a very big help for a lot of people. Thanks for your ear/eye. :) NameisToad 19:41, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

I'll find out how, and I'll do it, let me the time to find out... :P

EDIT: Don't call me Mr., I'M probably younger than you...

EDIT: This seems to be out of my powers, let's wait for Peerless to see this. :) Borror0 19:58, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

I think he took care of it. You fast learner, you! d-: Big Brother 22:45, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

More lucky than anything. I was wandering on the wiki and saw a link to your talk page, I click on it to read soemthing and notice a message you left to thiocan. :P Borror0 23:08, July 10, 2007 (EDT)

News

Regarding this - I spellchecked a bit, and removed the list - if you want, you can edit the home page and update the current projects section on the sidebar, with that kind of info, K? That's why I added it in there d-: elliottcable (talk, site) 20:47, July 21, 2007 (EDT)

About deleting and reverting "not in DDO!11!1" articles

I'm disapointed on you. The box says Dungeons and Dragons online.

Craft is going to be implented to the game. You wan't the article to be there now or add it later when users have visited the page and done the remark that this site is coming roughly a quarter year behind in time from changes in the game?
Fixing grammar and simply badly written articles should be thanked instead of shouted. When every other word is link to some other too general article or written in half l33t talk, it eats the site credibility. Having that check mark image/link after each word makes reading hard.
The farter you go from D&D facts and telling what the difference ingame, the more useless this site for users that play the real game. The D&D newbies would learn what the DDO should have or is lacking. Also the lack of sources is bad.
Wasting space? I got 1,5G free space behind a 200T bandwith, ask nicely and i might help you out.
With foldering i meant the double catgorizing at the bottom of pages and the missing real categorys.
I sorry if you have high hopes for the site but as i look your progression over the past years lenght the result ain't that splendid. Too sloopy work.
You could have told me how this wiki versio does categorys and the site might be bit easier navigate, insted you just remarked that i should not do categorying.

Based on these, your frontpage plea for editors should be reconsidered. If you wan't help, let me help. BlackSmith 15:44, July 31, 2007 (EDT)

Well, BlackSmith:

Crafting is going to be implemented. How, we don't know yet. If you have additionnal information except "they have said they are going to add to the game but we don't know yet" please let me know, point me your source. I'd be happy to add it. I'll be honest, I didn't read the Craft page as I already deleted a few pages of "Not in DDO" and I know for sure that craft isn't in-game. I'd like to point out that I'm here sice only June, so don't bash me for the previous work. I'm working on restoring the wiki. Follow me, or don't. I'm telling that the wiki is "a work in progress" as there are a lot of editing/updating to do.
Where didn't I thank you for correcing typos? Could you point me pages written in l33t talk?
The difference between PnP and DDO page!! There you go, there it goes! See differences, #Wasting was meant in the sens of "read space". If a page has useful information hidden in useless information, it is considerated useless to me. Also, an useless page is... useless the option are either to make it useful or to delete it. I think I make the right decision each time.
Point me the missing real categories, I'll add them. What is the problem wwith multiple categories? An article cannot be in multiples? I find it logical and useful. Got any alternative? I'll listen.
Working on it, don't bash me. The website has been left on his own a while, I'm there do "undust the selves and buy new books".
What do you not understand? I'll explain. :)

My plea for editors should not be reconsidereated. When you get a new job, shown how to work? Here we give information to those who want to read. We let you guys make mistakes and correct you when you do. We show you the right way. We teach you to edit properly. There is a certain structure to follow.

Lastly, I'd like to adress the Dundeon and Dragon Online thingy. Sure, it's D&D... Online. There are differencesm don't hide it. There is missing stuff, you have Action Points and enhancements, etc. We must not confuse the reader with unnecessary information, ok? :) Borror0 16:09, July 31, 2007 (EDT)

Back

Hey, I've been gone for 2 weeks. Care to give me the quick recap as to what's been up, and hit me with some PPoIs regarding things I need to check up on? Thanks d-: elliottcable (talk, site) 01:54, August 16, 2007 (EDT)

Welcome back! Glad to see you again. I'll try to be quick as I'm not on my computer.

Check Eurydice's edits. She has done a few edits of Categories. I trust her, but I'm a bit lost and I don't know how you plan these things to look like.
There have been a few vandals. Just check the deletion log to see who they are and please take action against them, I'm currently logging in only to chekc if things are going OK on the wiki, I'll be back to editing on the 2oth! :D
You've already seen the "drama" between BlackSmith and I. I really think he could be a good editor, specially the PnP differences. He has an huge list on the EU forums. I'll try to hit him up on the EU forums.
Crwth has taken care of the server merge. Just check if he haven't missed anything.
I've left some pages "unpatrolled", consider these your PPoIs! ;)

Once again, welcome back. See you on the 2oth!

EDIT: Also, you number of edits on the Home page is gone :O Borror0 11:18, August 16, 2007 (EDT)

Request for template change

Erken here. I have been updating some missing pages on quests and filling out the quest templates for them. One section thats missing is the ability to show what the favour reward for the quest on Normal, hard and elite is. Currently I am putting this as text in the quest description that I am adding. Prefferably this should be part of the template quest box. Ideally I want to add a favour=8, 16, 24 line to each for example.

Cheers for any feedback. Also, it was not really obvious to me how to post a new topic in your talk page so I did it this way. Any pointers on how to do that? Erken 17:07, August 23, 2007

I'll let him deal with the templates unless he needs to specifically ask me for help. But regarding the information about editing talk pages... that should be obvious d-:

There's a purple bar that shows up above the editing box on every talk page you edit, please read the links in that bar, specifically the wikiquette one (I haven't had time to type out the discussion policy yet). elliottcable (talk, site) 15:59, August 23, 2007 (EDT)

Cheers for the info. Lets hope I am a quick learner.. Erken 19:38, August 23, 2007 (EDT)

You seem to do quite well. If you can't do something, just ask and Elliott and I will do it for you, depending on the ammount knowledge it'll take. (Read: Elliott is the master wiki and I am stilll learning a lot.) Borror0 07:26, August 24, 2007 (EDT)

Its very much like updating the HTML help docs for some of the products we have at work. Although I try and avoid that task as much as possible, its just a slightly different interface and syntax. Erken 07:32, August 24, 2007 (EDT)

It is a lot like HTML - in fact, most raw HTML is allowed through the parser. Some wikiml duplicates html functionality for ease of maintenance ('''bold''' makes more sense in many cases than <B>bold</B> - and yes, I know capatalized tags are invalid XHTML - I gave up trying to serve anything wiki-related as valid a long time ago) but if you're more comfortable with it, HTML markup is fine (though it does obfuscate the source for future editors.

And templates aren't that difficult to understand if you've used SSI or anything more complicated, perhaps some playing with PHP or whatnot.

But again, anything confusing, just leave a note on my talk page - or ping me, my IM and other contact information is linked from my talk page. elliottcable (talk, site) 00:50, August 27, 2007 (EDT)

Help request about adding missing quests

Heya, been looking into how to add new quests which currently are not listed. As all the main quest pages seem to be look up tables, I have not been able to work out how to add a quest. I think there should be an option somewhere to just create a new page, but as I dont know where it is (yet) the only way I assume I can do it, is to create a link to a page that doesnt exists and then edit that page. Preferably I just want to be able to just say "create this quest page" and fill in the quest info box and wayhey its there.

The only other things thats bothering me atm, is how do you get to the talk pages for a given topic? Ideally I wanted to post this on the actual quests pages, but I am too dumb to figure out how. Erken 07:58, August 28, 2007 (EDT)

Regarding the page creation, that's what I do. I edit a page, hit live preview and click the red link. I also sometimes search the page and when it gives me no result, I create the page.

Regarding talk page, see at the left top corner of your screem Article & Discussion. Click on discussion and you're on the talk page. Borror0 09:09, August 28, 2007 (EDT)

Favor List

I found a favor list on the main forums in Google Docs and I exported it to Excel. I created an excel spreadsheet of it and would love for it to get up here somehow. Any ideas? I can email you the excel ss.

Go for it.

PS- Sign you posts like this ~~~~. Borror0 13:29, September 11, 2007 (EDT)

Sorry, how do I find your email address? Scottvin 13:39, September 11, 2007 (EDT)

On your right, you'll find "e-mail" this user. ;) Borror0 14:16, September 11, 2007 (EDT)

Site Format/Sizing

I had a friend reviewing some of my work here on the DDOwiki and he mentioned that because of the ads on the left and site navigation bar on the right that he was getting a horizontal scroll bar. It turns out, he was in 1280x960 and I did my edit in 1680x1050. Does DDOwiki not textwrap for whatever screen size you are using? Mad Bombardier 10:04, November 2, 2007 (EDT)

I beleive you talk about the DR page?

It's this function:

     Hello, I am Borror!

It does not change line, ever. You've got to do it yourself. If it,s not that, please point me out that page. :) Borror0 10:43, November 2, 2007 (EDT)

Yup, that's it. I was trying to reuse existing formatting whereever I could. I guess I need to size those example fields down a bit. Is there any other template/format for examples? Mad Bombardier 11:31, November 2, 2007 (EDT)

I wish, I don't like the look of it either. I've not yet seen something that could do. I'll have a talk with Elliott. I'll see, might have something in store.

I don't like the non-formating and the colors aren't that great. ;) Borror0 11:49, November 2, 2007 (EDT)