DDO wiki talk:Administrators' noticeboard

Spoilers
I notice that all throughout the wiki we see SPOILERS everywhere in bold, caps, italics and so forth, now I understand entirely that editors are trying to alert others reading the wiki that there is information about to be read that may lead to knowledge prior to reading. BUT I'm raising this topic for the following reason (and it may seem a poor reason to some but here it is):

The entire content of DDOwiki is a spoiler, why do we have these alerts throughout when those reading are fully aware they at any point could be about to read something they did not know - that is why they are here firstly and throughout their experiece of DDOwiki over time, its always spoiler material, everything here is; please don't just shoot me down - I like to rock the status quo and see where it goes (valid arguement of course required), I'm wondering what others thoughts are on this and the reasoning behind it.

Agonshar (Contributions • Message) 20:50, May 12, 2014 (EDT)


 * There are too many alerts. I no longer see them (like web page advertisements). GregJ (Contributions • User talk:GregJ) 09:40, January 1, 2016 (EDT)

User:Cordovan -- advanced permissions
I've recently found some things that concern me on the wiki, and I'd like to get some community feedback on giving Cordovan the ability to protect/delete/oversight things that may violate existing NDAs and/or invade on the privacy / put at risk living persons. I'd personally monitor administrative actions to make sure things are on the up and up (I've no reason whatsoever to expect anything other than), but would like them to have the ability to make such changes immediately if there is even a remote chance of there being a potential issue. We can always discuss changes after and revert if needed. I intend to give him these permissions if he is interested in them, until there is a consensus for him to have or an objection to him having. I confirmed that this user is the real Cordovan back when the account was first made, if there is any question about that. Feel free to email me any direct concerns that you don't want public here. I look forward to feedback from community members. ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 13:29, June 22, 2015 (EDT)
 * While I think it's a good idea for grant Cordovan higher rights based solely on his position at Turbine, I feel that the DDO Wiki (a fan run site) shouldn't have official Turbine employees as administrators (you know I love ya Jerry!). I know that several devs frequent the site and some even perform edits periodically, I just don't think it's the place of a Turbine employee to police up a fan site in that manner.  Perhaps a good alternative solution would be to have a trusted member of each year's Players Council be promoted to admin during their tenure to help police up any potential NDA violations. Quite frankly, who else is going to know if the NDA has been violated.  That would make much more sense to me.  I know that this year, we have several wiki admins involved in the PC, but the same may not be true in future councils.  Just food for thought.  Thoughts? -- Ague (Talk · Contribs · B · D · I · P · PM · PP · UM · UR) 13:49, June 22, 2015 (EDT)
 * I guess I'm more of a mindset that I'd rather them be able to nuke and discuss than leave potentially libellous content/information on wiki were it can do harm until they can find someone that has a moment to take care of it. As it currently stands, Jerry knows he could email me or get in touch with me fairly quickly via various methods and I would nuke something immediately then open a discussion for it.  I just don't see why he should have to, he already indicated back in a May, 2013 email where he replied to me "If it’s all the same to you, I’d rather have the same writing permissions as everyone else, rather than be a super user, as I know enough Wiki to get things done, but not enough that I wouldn’t be afraid of messing something up as a super. Thanks!" and then again today in a PM "I've always felt that one of the Wiki's strongest assets was its divestiture from the corporate structure, so the fewer exceptional permissions I have the better. I prefer to be hands-off for the most part, and would not be interested in deleting things from the Wiki. Every now and then I've made edits, but that's almost always because I have access to something that is otherwise not available (pics of special event items from the past, for example.)"
 * That said, I guess this is kind of a moot point since he doesn't want the ability. Jerry, like I said above, if there is something - feel free to email me or message me on FB or send me a text message on my phone and I'll take care of it as soon as reasonably possible. ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 14:13, June 22, 2015 (EDT)
 * I think Cordo has enough to do on the forums. Also, I don't recall any stuff that would require policing in the past years. That said, if he wants/needs admin rights, I couldn't care less. However, I don't think wiki admins in general should worry about PC NDAs. If I see an interesting leak on the Vault, I don't mind putting it on the wiki (within reason)--Cru121 (Contributions • Message) 14:10, June 22, 2015 (EDT).
 * There have been a couple minor leaks, but few have known about them as they have typically gotten dealt with quickly and without fuss or discussion. Perhaps I'm being an overzealous worry wart, but I'm an err on the side of caution type of guy with this as I want the wiki's communication and relationship with the game itself to be strong. :) ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 14:13, June 22, 2015 (EDT)
 * I'm with Cru on this, I dont want wiki to be a place NDA-violation stuff get posted first (uhh DDOwikileaks do we call it?) but when there had been a leak and such on some other places then I think we shouldn't hide the fact. Also, I'm against giving him such right. I dont wanna see him deleting stuff left and right here in the same manner as he cube threads on the official forums. No matter who that is, one must earn it by contributing. Wiki should remain independent. --yoko5000 (Contributions • Message) 05:25, June 27, 2015 (EDT)
 * I think this topic is clear, Cordovan is an employee of Turbine, this website is a fansite only, I would certainly not want to be witness to information dissapearing because it violates any NDA's at Turbine and Cordovan would by default have to follow those NDA's if he is in contact with any information which violates it, we should not be placing him in that position nor should he be in that positon because of the repurcussions. Agonshar (Contributions • Message) | My projects  |  My ToDo list  |  My Sandbox  |  My Links  15:54, August 30, 2015 (EDT)

T:Power and Melee/Ranged Power
Since we already have a T:Power for spell points from power effect, and we have a spellpower template for spellpower, I'm thinking we should group melee and ranged power into T:DmgPower. Thoughts or opinions? ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 11:24, July 16, 2015 (EDT)
 * Not that I'd use it so much, but I think it's more intuitive if you just have them in separate templates. Otherwise you'd have to add a switch in. Someone who doesn't use the template much would end up having to look it up. --Thalone 18:36, July 16, 2015 (EDT)
 * It's coded (can be moved) and there is no switch. It's use is simple, Ranged or Melee. ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 19:08, July 16, 2015 (EDT)

Shoe and the Home Screen
What are you trying to do? I see double now on the update preview boxes. I'm not going to fix it bc I know you're in the middle of whatever you're trying to do. Let me know if you need any help. -- Ague (Talk · Contribs · B · D · I · P · PM · PP · UM · UR) 12:33, July 29, 2015 (EDT)
 * Yeah, I'll fix that. Working on making all of the updates available on the main page in a overflow area that scrolls from newest to oldest. I have a fair portion of it working, just distracted... ShoeMaker (Contributions • Message) 12:46, July 29, 2015 (EDT)

DDO Forum avatars!
DDOwiki editors who are interested now have some DDO forum avatars that you can use to indicate your wiki editing -- https://www.ddo.com/forums/profile.php?do=editavatar&categoryid=30 ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 21:10, January 15, 2016 (EST)

Discuss renaming wiki processes...
After a recent incident with a page renaming, I can see that new editors might be confused with the use some of the words used for certain processes on the wiki such as move, delete, and maybe refresh. I can complete the changes (I had changed delete to recycle a long time ago (as recycle indicated it worked like a recycle bin where stuff isn't actually deleted), but that was lost in an update to the system), if there is consensus to do so. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 11:00, February 13, 2016 (EST)

"Move" to ...
Technically, it is moving the content of the page from one database entry to another, but I don't think it would be harmful to call it a rename process as that is what most non-editors/new editors would see it as. Thoughts? Comments? ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 11:00, February 13, 2016 (EST)


 * Renaming it to "rename" (heh) makes a lot of sense. You're not really moving anything, you're just changing the name. LrdSlvrhnd (Contribs • Message • Email ) 01:14, February 14, 2016 (EST)

"Delete" to ...
Technically, it is hiding the content of the page by applying a flag to the entry that hides it from view. I think people get the wrong idea when things are "deleted" thinking they are actually gone and I think that if we used the word "hide" (and "oversight", which adds a second flags that says even administrators can't see it), it would be much less confusing to some. We don't get a lot of requests for deletion, but when we do, many of them seem to be under the impression that it will "free disk space" which isn't true at all (it actually adds a couple extra bytes to the entry). Thoughts? Comments? ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 11:00, February 13, 2016 (EST)
 * I support this as well. Though I'm not sure about "hide"; I'll have to try to think of a different word.  Looking at synonyms for ideas, I kinda like "tuck away" lol LrdSlvrhnd (Contribs • Message • Email ) 01:14, February 14, 2016 (EST)
 * I did have it as "Recycle" at one time, like a "recycle bin". Just one option, open to others. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 19:42, February 14, 2016 (EST)
 * Most wiki peeps don't realize that "deleted" edits and pages don't actually get deleted, so I don't think that a change is super necessary here. Deleting a page just hides it and since the general user base can't delete a page anyways it seems like a moot point. Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR) 12:04, May 6, 2016 (EDT)
 * They can't directly delete them, but there will be a "delete" or "hide" option for them that allows them to have some control by tagging them for deletion by an administrator. Since nothing is ever really "deleted", I think that is a misleading term and it should be changed to hide/hidden or suppress (which has it's own meaning that only stewards can see it) or something that indicates its true status. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 16:07, May 6, 2016 (EDT)

"Refresh" to ...
This is what is internally called the "purge" process, which is inconsistent with the term "refresh" in the drop-down menu. I don't remember what we call it in DDO:BYPASS, but what new users see should be consistent. Thoughts? Comments? ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 11:00, February 13, 2016 (EST)


 * ...I actually have no idea what this is supposed to do, so I have nothing to say about this. LrdSlvrhnd (Contribs • Message • Email ) 01:14, February 14, 2016 (EST)
 * I think keeping it as Refresh is good. Purge has a ring about it that seems like something is being removed (and I know that the cache is being cleaned for that page), but I think Refresh is ample. Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR) 12:07, May 6, 2016 (EDT)

DeSpammer gadget.
Good day fellow administrators! I want to announce a new administrative gadget I wrote a week or two ago that will block a spam only account and delete/rollback all contributions automatically right from the recent changes "new account log" line. I'll be adding it do the test phase gadgets by Friday night so you can try it out. There's a couple things I'm debating changing, but it should be fully functional. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 09:48, February 18, 2016 (EST)
 * Spam. How to combat it? Any ideas? Reading this, not understanding much. -- Cru121 (Contribs • Message • Email ) 13:47, May 28, 2016 (EDT)
 * ShoeMaker is working on getting Extension:TitleBlacklist (MediaWiki:Titleblacklist) working and Extension:SpamBlacklist installed. I'm hoping to put them to good use once available. —&thinsp; Zav &thinsp; (T·C) 14:07, May 28, 2016 (EDT)
 * Yes, and I've also been working on some improvements to the deSpammer gadget itself based on the most recent wave of bots. Away for the weekend, but will work on it more when I get home. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 17:41, May 28, 2016 (EDT)


 * Can I get some info about what information to hide from logs for spam? Ideally add it directly to the "Delete/undelete revisions" page so that I know what to click. -- Cru121 (Contribs • Message • Email ) 02:13, May 31, 2016 (EDT)
 * It's kind of `undefined` at the moment. Use your best judgement.  Personally, I've started removing user creation logs since that day when there were almost 100 spambots in one day.  Just because it keeps the user creation log cleaner and those accounts don't need to be listed as creation since they are only spambots and they are listed in the block log anyway.  I'll get back to working on deSpammer soon (the new changes were almost done last week, just haven't had time to finish it yet), and it will all be done by that script. :) ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 07:46, May 31, 2016 (EDT)
 * For the deletion log: Usually hiding target and parameters is all that is needed. If you delete a spam page outside of DeSpammer, forget to erase the automatically populated other/additional reason, and that text is spam, then hide the edit summary too. The editor doesn't need to be hidden here since it is the admin that deleted the page. —&thinsp; Zav &thinsp; (T·C) 23:07, May 31, 2016 (EDT)

Calling all graphic artists!!!
So, I decided that I wanted to have the wiki host a contest for a new primary graphic for the home page and social media sites (,, DDOwiki Discord chat , etc. The first question that I got on the forum post -  - was if we would consider an animated image for the home page main image.  I responded that I'd have to get input on the topic from the other wiki administrators and possibly .  I have some personal feelings on the topic, but I'm going to withhold them at this time to get some untainted feedback from you all first. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 23:48, May 3, 2016 (EDT)
 * Starting public polls on the topic as well. Check out @DDOwiki's Tweet: https://twitter.com/DDOwiki/status/727823830505394177?s=09 is the Twitter one to get a feel of the community's opinion. Final decision will still be admins. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 12:39, May 4, 2016 (EDT)
 * Twitter poll: https://twitter.com/DDOwiki/status/727823830505394177?s=09
 * Facebook poll: https://www.facebook.com/DDOwiki/posts/1801552656733287
 * Forum poll: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/475082
 * My personal take on this is that I don't believe that most wiki users come here are going to care one way or another what (if any) logo is present. I really don't think there is anything wrong with the current logo.  It is simple and doesn't detract from the purpose of the wiki.  I think an animated logo would not do much more than a static logo would.  Players come here for game information and not so much to see flashy graphics that doesn't directly correlate to what they are wanting to learn about the game.  I'm a firm believer of "if it isn't broke, don't fix it", and there really isn't anything wrong with the current logo.  As for the splash image on the center of the front page, why couldn't that just be a screen capture of whatever the current pack is?  On ddo.com, there are typically professionally done images for the most recent couple packs on there.  Just my 2cp. Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR) 12:46, May 5, 2016 (EDT)
 * Guess I need to clarify here. Not looking for a logo, just a home page center piece/Social media header/banner. I'll reserve my comments on animation until, , , and any other active administrator has had a chance to comment. I'll note that there are about 3 days left on the existing community polls. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 20:17, May 5, 2016 (EDT)
 * An animated gif could be okay. I think it would need to be judged on a case by case basis. Blinking, flashing, etc. are a definite no. For performance and/or compatibility it might not be a good idea. Overall, I don't think animation is necessary. This is to be featured on Home; how much time does one spend there? —&thinsp; Zav &thinsp; (T·C) 00:08, May 6, 2016 (EDT)
 * I never read Home, unless I want to check if news are displayed correctly. I don't have any preference about the picture(s). I guess once there's a list of proposals, I might have an opinion whether I like any or not. For example, I liked the tome-reading pic I saw on the forums. I guess some kind of library or reading books would be a good fit. -- Cru121 (Contribs • Message • Email ) 02:09, May 6, 2016 (EDT)


 * Featured on home, as a banner,  as a header, and any other social media sites we might create a wiki account/page on.  I'm guessing some of those might prohibit .gif images.  So, I'm not sure it's worth allowing bothering at all.  I suppose we could allow it for place that do and tell them they have to pick a solid frame for sites that don't allow it? ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 02:13, May 6, 2016 (EDT)
 * I do think that it would be a good idea to have set dimensions for the image. 16:9 is probably the most portable dimensions and will easily fit or be cropped into all of those social media sites that you mentioned.  Keeping the main focal image in a 4:3 portion of the image would be best in the event that cropping would need to occur.  I say 16:9 because having experience with those sites that's the best option.  The image would also need to be large enough to have to never need to scale it larger (and loose quality) and can easily be scaled down to fit where needed.  Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR) 11:59, May 6, 2016 (EDT)
 * In the forum post I specified 1500x500px which was what one of the sites it will be on specified as an "optimal" banner size. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 16:05, May 6, 2016 (EDT)
 * All of the To allow animated or not to allow animated polls have closed, and I've consolidated the which will probably be locked by  this afternoon at some point once U31 stuff is done.  Looks like Twitter people are mostly in favor of allowing (while being split on whether or not blinking should be allowed) and the forum/Facebook polls lean in the direction of no animation.  I'll let y'all comment and hopefully I'll be able to post my thoughts by the end of this weekend. :) ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message • Email ) 09:22, May 10, 2016 (EDT)

Proposed answer to the question of if animations will be allowed

 * I'll lead in here I guess in order to get this moving and have an answer for the OP. I propose that we say that animated entries will be allowed under the condition that they are more of a "slide show" type animation with a slow progression rate and that stills for each frame are available/submitted as well so we can pick a single frame instead of the animation if we like. ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message<span class="emailLink emailTechnical_13"> • Email ) 09:00, May 14, 2016 (EDT)
 * That sounds good to me. —&thinsp; Zav &thinsp; (T·C) 23:09, May 14, 2016 (EDT)
 * A slide show is a decent compromise Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR)

Template Changes
Hey all, if anyone makes any major changes to a template, please notify me immediately of the change. The newest page that I'm working on for YourDDO parses the templates very heavily for item effects and if there are major changes, it will break the system. I don't care if you change them, just please let me know you changed them so i can adjust accordingly in my scripts... Ague (Talk · Contribs &thinsp;•&thinsp;Email · B&thinsp;•&thinsp;D&thinsp;•&thinsp;I · P&thinsp;•&thinsp;PM&thinsp;•&thinsp;PP · UM&thinsp;•&thinsp;UR) 02:53, June 17, 2016 (EDT)
 * It'd be a lot easier on you and us if you simply watchlist the templates that affect what YourDDO parses and then have the wiki send you an email if one of those pages changes. Let me know if you need help setting it up. :) ShoeMaker (Contribs • Message<span class="emailLink emailTechnical_13"> • Email ) 09:17, June 17, 2016 (EDT)